I am still trying to wrap my mind around the video that we watched last week called the fridge. I feel that even though the image was good, the profanity was not necessary at all in the film. It didn't complete it at all and made the film utterly revolting. I have also struggled with this in my faith because in the bible it clearly talks about how we are to " put away anger, wrath, malice, slander, and OBSCENE TALK from your mouth. (Colossians 3:8-10) Another verse is Psalms 19:14 - Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart be acceptable in your sight my rock and my salvation. How can the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart be acceptable to God when I am constantly being fed junk from this world and the movie that we watched. There are problems in this world yes, I realize that, but to over emphasize the point with that much profanity was in my view a stepping out of bounds. Psalms 119 says how can a young man keep his way pure? By living according to the word. The word says to turn away from such evils clearly. So if we claim to live by the word and don't follow it we live a lie. That is why I feel that the material needs to be suitable for its audience. Am I the only one that feels this way?
This is a good discussion starter! Excitement! Now first off I would like to say that I do not support cussing of any kind. If someone swears a lot my opinion of them certainly doesn't increase (although it doesn't always decrease). I wish people could express themselves in different ways but that, sadly, is just not how our world is. That picture the short film presented was real life. In our world, no matter how unwelcome it is, people cuss like sailors and drink like there is no tomorrow. Sad? Yes. But its how things are. By making these people foul mouthed and disgusting it makes it all the more powerful that THEY are the ones who help instead of the prim proper, non-cussing, God fearing people who turned aside and pretended there was nothing there to see. A foul mouthed, scottish good Samaritan!
ReplyDeleteWas not the Samaritan also hated? Did the Jews not think them slime and filth to be overlooked? Basically what I am trying to say is that I believe that it did make the story stronger. It made us not like them and yet in the end we saw them differently. I think without the profanities the story just wouldn't have been as powerful.
I understand what you are saying though. I really do.
Obscene talk doesn't just mean cussing, it means anything that comes out of our mouth with harsh intentions. I personally do not cuss. Why? Because I was raised not to. I feel that me cussing would offend people. The point of Christians not cussing is so that we can be set apart from the world. It's a way to show people how we are "different".
ReplyDeleteI think that when trying to get a point across sometimes cussing is necessary. Cussing can really put new, deep emotions in a person, which is really, in my opinion, an artist's goal. There are pastor's who cuss. They cuss because they don't see anywhere in the Bible condemning cussing and because they truly believe that it isn't wrong.
When I watched Fringe, I too was taken aback by the amount of cussing... mostly because they were the only words I could perfectly understand. I've always tended to look at cussing as an art. If you use it in the right way, I believe that even cussing can bring glory to God's name. On the flip side, cuss words can be used as garbage and bring anything but glory to God. I think that when dealing with cussing, you need to be observant and creative.
Regardless, believe in what you believe but remember that when you watch a film like Fringe to keep your mind open. Even if there is a lot of cussing in a film... it doesn't quite mean that the moral behind all of it is junk too.
I feel like you have to stay true to your characters including their demographic and their diction. I feel like to eradicate the language from that particular film would be to take away from the reality of the time and the area. I know for a fact that in Europe those words are thrown around all the time. The film just wouldn't be realistic if those words weren't in there. If we replace certain words with "appropriate language" it comes across and tacky and why is that? Because that's not how people talk. Its just that simple.
ReplyDeleteI personally have no problem whatsoever with cussing, except for when they take God's name in vain. That I feel uncomfortable with. The others, though, I don't care about. They even come out from time to time, depending.
ReplyDeleteI think the thing about the film, is that it's just a film. And it's not trying to shock you, or make you feel like it's overly obscene. It's staying true to the characters. It's not trying to protect anyone's feelings or, be careful of how it expresses itself. It just is what it is, no apologies.
Though the thing I find interesting is that you aren't appalled by anything else. I'd consider the violence or the uncaring of most the characters to be 80 million times more obscene, at least to me. There's a woman being beaten cruelly, till she's bleeding, an insensible act of violence,but you're more concerned with the fact that they cuss more than you like.
Now I can see where you're coming from. My dad has, for the most part, the exact same view. But that also depends on your views as christians. The thing you are casting judgement on hasn't even committed to the same standards! It's just film. Not for cussing or against. The verse you gave says, "Don't let foul language come out of your mouth." It's not asking you to judge them on what comes out of their mouth. Or asking you to be comfortable with it. Everyone has something they feel uncomfortable with/about. It's saying watch yourself. Be accountable for yourself.
One of my favorite authors, Anne Lammont, cusses throughout her book, Traveling Mercies, Some Thoughts on Faith. And it's beautiful. It adds that bit of humanity that just pushes the fact home that she's not trying to be the "perfect christian". She's just trying to be herself, as a christian. I also sometimes feel that christians can ruin their witness by being too concerned with stuff like cussing. I know I've felt looked down upon by people with an, "All cussing is bad!" attitude. And most of these people don't even know that I cuss sometimes.
Another example: I have a friend, who I dearly love. But I feel uncomfortable with how fast and how long she condemns people. I would rather she cuss every other word, and not be so judge, and grudge-holdy, and just be more loving.
It's what's in the heart that matters, right? The subtext that we pick up on. The little gestures that mean so much. It seems odd to me that people get hung up on such a little detail, when in the long run, it'll just be a tiny blip on the radar.
I hope I haven't rambled to long. This is something I feel strongly about, and it's good to have someone with the opposite viewpoint share, right? I hope I haven't offended anyone. If I have? Deal with it. In the nicest way possible.
I grew up with the notion that swearing is totally wrong. But in the last few years I have come to find that anger is wrong. If you swear with hate then it is wrong. If you do anything in hate it is wrong. YOu see people call other people stupid jokingly and no one thinks a second though. But if someone calls another person some cuss word, it is the end of the world. I am not a fan of mindless swearing and i don't swear usually my self. no one that knows me would say I swear in a normal conversation. It's just not me. And In movies I find it can express some, or make a situation funny. But Frankly my dear, I don't give a damn.
ReplyDelete"Don't point and cuss"
ReplyDeleteAbi I don't know you but, you are fricken awesome!
ReplyDeleteWhy, thank you. I thought I might have rambled too long... But some things just feel like they need to be said. And for me, this subject is one of them. And if I keep typing, I'm going to end up on my little cussing soap box again...
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ReplyDeleteI believe the irony that is being missed here can be summarized by the anecdote Prof. Leeper told concerning Tony Campolo:
ReplyDelete"What's worse is that you're more upset with the fact that I said shit..."
I understand anyone's uneasiness regarding the use of obscene language in this film, but as of right now, this topic is the most commented on topic of our entire class blog, which consists of over 120 posts already.
While it is ultimately your decision to come to whatever place in life you do as far as foul language is concerned, do not let the use of said foul language overshadow the incredible story within The Fridge. Do not let that be the majority of what we talk about. It presented a group of people who were, by many of our own accounts, the scum of the Earth. I would go out on a limb to say that each one of us could easily identify with one or more of those characters, including, but also beyond their use of language, and THAT'S the point.
Are we to turn away from the evils of this world? Absolutely. But what does that mean? it means we keep all things in proper place and perspective. Turning away from something does not account for the fact that, though you no longer see it, it's still there all the same. It must be addressed.
This use of foul language is, in my humble opinion, a moot point.
I hate that I'm doing this, but I feel I must also give a disclaimer: please do not think that within the confines of anything I'm writing is a judgmental treatise on any one of your personal beliefs. I am not apologizing in case anything I've said offends you (I could really care less because, let's be honest, we could all use a little offensiveness in our lives), but I am apologizing if you feel I'm not giving your opinions the proper respect that they deserve and I so wish to exemplify.
And one last note: let's not forget that this is a foreign film, full of cultural traditions and norms that we are unfamiliar with. To my knowledge and experience (firsthand, actually, as I've spent some time in the United Kingdom), this kind of language is not all that offensive. In many ghettos, it is simply a part of their language, as much as "crap", "shoot", and "gosh darnit" are a part of ours (also, all those words I just quoted are equally as offensive as any words used in the film, but just spelled differently).
Also, my apologies for the deleted posts. I had some connection troubles and didn't realize I posted the same comment multiple times. I promise, I didn't censor myself and delete something I would have not said in the first place.
ReplyDeleteWas it the words that upset you, or the intensity of the piece they were presented in? When the man couldn't find help I felt like I privy to someone's nightmare and wanted the video to stop.
ReplyDeleteThe character is the character, and if they cuss in the real world they must do so in your fiction. And we can't turn a blind eye towards art because the words we hear make us unsettled.
They are just words. They can't hurt you, and in time they may even lose their punch. Humbug for example, made famous by The Christmas Carol, was orginally a cuss word on the same level as B*llsh*t (see what I did there with the star thingys, I'm proud of myself for showing such control)
What I find interesting is that you are experiecing exactly what Leeper said he did when he went to art school. Right off the bat he was confronted with art that made him uncomfortable. Give it time and maybe you'll adapt like he did.